Thoughts, concerns, opinions add whatever you believe needs to or should be done.

Feel free to message me anonymously if you don't feel comfortable posting.

I'll be submitting a ticket with the compiled concerns.

Edit: I won't include every response in the ticket word for word but I will direct them to view this thread for full quotes and to see examples that require more detail

Anonymous: "lul scroll printer go brrr"

[2]09:00 Jeffreyj[Pond]: I think the devs sharing their light on the reasoning behind the update might clarify some things

[2]10:44 Durins_Bane[Moria]: if i get a woodcutting one im selling it to market to show how stupid it's been rolled out

Edited on 21-06-2020 23:18

It seems like this all should have started as a quest that every player could do, or not do. For instance, go see the king. He sends you to kill 1000 salamanders and when completed he says.. oh good job! now we need 100 obby long swords and btw, here is a woodcutting scroll!
Turn in 100 obby long swords and he says, oh good job! now go kill a bunch of yeti's and btw, here is a mining scroll!
Now we need 100k gp. Pay it.. oh good job. there's a cave you can go in, and btw here's a shop scroll!
Not sure about the order of all that but you get the drift.

I suggest all 4 scrolls be added to the rima shop. Players that want them can buy them. 25k each seems a good price, maybe 50k for the combat one. This saves time and effort by the coders, making it very simple.

Its one month later and despite being on 16 hours a day i dont have a single scroll to access content i have the levels for, but other players can access and benfit from this content, and theyve had access for weeks now.

Info on their drop mechanism like which actions will drop a scroll

I think we all need to not complain and pray to the RNG lords instead

these scrolls are a pain in the arse but i presume sooner or later everyone will be able to obtain through quest or buying but the current idea being that only a few get access to the new update by sheer luck for a while

Can you elaborate on how either of those are a concern or a suggestion Pantera? I'm asking for thought out posts with actual substance to them, not more whining about people having issues with the update.

The scrolls are a gift to Syrnians as a clan. It shows how certain clans can work together on a high level. The greed of some players puts sand in their eyes and they don’t see the bigger picture.
I was salty at first, but after a while you understand what the game staff is/was striving for.

I don't actually agree, Glenn. I get where you're coming from, but the issue is that there's no coordinated way to get scrolls except just hope you're lucky. If a scroll was buyable from some new shop, at say, 75k platina for instance, or 2 million gp, it then becomes a clan effort to be able to purchase them. That way, though, there's a clear progression - you know how close you are to a scroll at any given point.

This way, you just have to close your eyes and hope.

Edited on 16-06-2020 09:54

Glenn you're only NOT salty because Barun bought a palace and mining scroll and enticed the holder of a wood scroll to join TF. As of right now you guys are the ONLY clan with one of each of the "important" scrolls and thus can grow fat off the sales of tiromyth tools. You would be salty as all heck if it was TLO or Corps or some other clan with all 3 and you guys were still waiting on one or more of the scrolls to drop.

My clan on the other hand? Most of us seem to be absolutely OVER the scrolls. Sure we /finally/ had a Palace Scroll drop into our clan and were able to round robin share it to start the Open Sesame quest. However that still just gives ONE of us access to the caves. Even once Tin has consumed the scroll and can get to the smithing location we still are going to be at a loss since we cannot supply Bloodstone or Ancient Wood to him due to NOT having the necessary scrolls!


Personally I like the "drop" mechanic but would have preferred that it was ONLY the Palace scroll that dropped. That the /reward/ for completing the Open Sesame quest included the Shop scroll and that the Mining and Wood scrolls were on sale in the shop. (This would have also added a decent gold sink to the game!)

This would mean that a clan would only need ONE palace scroll to share amongst /all/ members. They would all be able to complete the Open Sesame quest and get the shop scroll and access to the other 2. Then the clan's highest smith could consume the palace scroll and gain access to the caves through the "Paying the Fee" quest.

This is still clans working together to support each other. While at the same time making it so not everyone is sitting with their thumb up their butts feeling like its a popularity contest or that only clans who can afford to pay millions of GP are going to get scrolls.


Personally starting to feel like this whole scroll mechanic is to distract us from the fact we won't get another update for 4 or 5 years.

Vamp - I actually really like that idea, but the issue sort of remains the same, you're still relying on a super lucky drop. In fact, it's even worse, because one drop unlocks things for a whole clan.

I think more transparency would help. The development team could at least let us know how many scrolls have been dropped/found.
And while I understand the scrolls are supposed to be rare, but we now have very rare scrolls that then allow for a rare item drop. Which makes the rare items double rare, if that makes sense.

It would be better to have a secondary way to obtain them. An expensive purchase, or a quest reward for a long but doable quest for the majority of the player base.

Edited on 17-06-2020 16:04

Barun this is true. But as it appears is that there are 4 scroll drops a week average. One of each. If the "rarity" of scrolls stayed the same but only 1 type dropped. That would mean 4 palace scrolls a week would drop on average. This would be far better as then within just a few short months, most clans would have had someone who had received one as a drop (or would have been able to purchase one from those who didn't care about their drop). If these clans had taken the opportunity as mine did to share out the Scroll so everyone could start the "Open Sesame" portion? This would mean that All clans would most likely have at least ONE person done the first quest and thus all clans would have access to bloodstone and ancient wood at least.

This would prevent the hate mail I'm sure TF is receiving (I would like to point out here that I meant NO ill will in my previous statement to Glenn. Was just trying to press home to him how it feels being the shoe on the other foot in this scenario.) Also while easing the hate mail to you guys it would give the rest of us hope that so many of us have lost. That is why I wish they would change the distribution of the scrolls.

Though its not only TF who is getting hate mail I wager. Might not be a correlation but right after Corps pointed out in world that we had multiple members on the "Open Sesame" quest someone decided that would be the /best/ time to just rat orb the bejeesus out of Kingswood. So might be all scroll holders will end up getting hate mail of a form at some point.

Regarding Liahs comment above, how about red chat announcing into world chat when someone finds a scroll and what one it is?

Edited on 16-06-2020 12:08

Regarding Liahs comment above, how about red chat announcing into world chat when someone finds a scroll and what one it is?

As a temporal mechanic working as a teaser for the new stuff, I could be ok with the scroll mechanic.

However if the mechanic is here to stay, I don't think blocking important top level main game by a very rare drop (or drops) fits the syrnia way or is good for the community. That is better for collectibles with no use in the main gameplay.

It's a staple of MMO games that content can be gated behind rare or hard to acquire items. These items can either be the thing that unlocks the content itself, equipment allowing players to compete or survive the challenges in that area or other options.

The intent of this being that players are expected to grind for the new content as much as possible in the hopes that they too are able to unlock it. Most instances of this, clans or guilds are able to grind for this content together, increasing the chance of someone being able to acquire it that can then benefit everyone but at the end of it there's an awful lot of RNG to it. For those who don't want to wait and grind to acquire these items, this is why sometimes the new items are sold for an outrageous price, because it's a way of paying for what otherwise could take days, weeks or months to achieve. If you have the money for it and the desperation to want it so badly then by all means if you have scrolls, sell them for as high a price as you can get.

Over time, as more of these items have entered circulation, it isn't uncommon for games to then reduce or rebalance the rarity slightly to allow more players access to the new commodity after it's bedded in slightly.

The important thing though is to simply know what actions can acquire that item and a relative chance of success. Doesn't need to be a specific number but at least a confirmation of it being rare, very rare etc. The development should not be expected to provide information of how many have been found either as that could lead to a witch hunt.

Does this current system give early players a leg up on it? Yes. Am I going to feel angry about it though? No. Way to fix this is to continue to follow the pattern of other examples; limited availability, opening up slowly over several months. Saying something is not like "The Syrnian Way" or doesn't fit the community is a ridiculous argument as nothing would ever change if you stuck to this existing way. The mechanic needs time to bed in, be refined and adjusted to both meet the creative direction the development wish to pursue but without causing too many problems and losing the entire player base, hence the above of sticking with it being a drop to access but reviewing the rate as things go on.

Edited on 16-06-2020 14:35

Calgor that is the best post I've read in a long time. Thank you. The penny has dropped for me and I can see the bigger picture now so ty hun ((hugs))

As for the dev team, well done to you all

That's a brilliant post, Calgor - I'm with you 100%

Calgor that only works if they review the drop rate and bump it up at a later date. With the way syrnia has worked over the years I'm kinda doubtful that will be done. Meaning they're just going to lose people who get tired of the game.


I do keep checking the premium points section though to see if they don't add the option to just buy the scrolls. Lot of MMO these days are Pay to Play/Pay to Win.

Calgor's post is correct to a degree.

The difference being you can't "grind" for the item. You don't complete a certain number of tasks with the aim of getting the item. An entire clan could spend the next 3 months at minimum timer locations and get nothing.

(And that's if the assumption that they can only drop from combat, mining, fishing and woodcutting is correct? We are having to assume as the drop rate is so low it could just be the case they are yet to drop from a different skill)

Someone could wake up hit a creature on Monday at 00:01 and get theirs. Syrnia seems to have been a grind kind of game, and whilst I understand rare drops, holding game content behind what amounts to a lucky drop is an instant turn off for a number of people.

Spend 4 or 5 years getting your smithing up to the level to use them, can't access the items for 2 years because no-one in your clan gets the lucky scroll drop to do the quest?

A grind doesn't necessarily require completing a number of quests or tasks with the aim of guaranteeing an item at the end of it. The concept of a grind can also include completing the same actions several times with the hopes that you may get something at the end of it and it is still possible to grind for an item off the same tasks, same monsters, same actions with no luck because of the nature of random chance. You could farm the same enemies in an RPG hoping one of them drops a rare item needing to complete a high end equipment set or unlock a secret quest chain, doesn't need to be a guaranteed return at the end of a long grind. Believe me I have spent weeks in games with entire groups farming the same cluster of mobs for something and got sod all...I'm looking at you Papal Fez.

If anything you could argue that the entire game mechanics up to now is all about the same grind. Magic requires gems which are obtained by random chance on kills or mining. Locked items are random drops from monsters and fishing. Seeds are from monster drops and woodcutting. If nobody ever got any of those random drops then it would be impossible to progress that skill and that content would be held back behind a random drop, doesn't matter that now you can buy them from others. You could go a whole day fishing and never get a single item other than fish so those skills cannot be progressed without buying them. The only difference with these scrolls is the much higher rarity associated with them which seems to blind people to the reality that this is again another RNG based option and no different to anything else to date.

The argument I have made fully supports reviewing the drop rate at a later date. What that date is, that's for someone in development to determine but initially there is nothing wrong with a very closed off group or a very low rate of return on these items and review who is using it, how much of the commodity has entered the game with the new changes etc and amend accordingly. It's a common tactic for most RPG games; make it difficult to get hold of, high prices and then eventually you drag the prices down as the quantity available increases and you also tweak to balance. The only issue is that this place has never gone with the common tropes of the genre and now that we have started to it has become unexpected. I would fully agree it needs to be made clear what actions can result in these items though because it removes the need for speculation and allows players to start the long grind for these items. Then if it is made clear whether the rate will be looked at in future then this would also handle concerns.

Edited on 16-06-2020 17:44

I am a fan of the scrolls. Cool new idea. Good job dev team.

Of course you are because your clan has them all.

Good post Calgor, Most here aren't used to the grinding aspect of MMO's where you grind for thousands of hours hoping you will get a drop.


Side note- You expect this dev team to lower/higher drop rates as needed? LOOOLOLOOLOL

They don't have a woodcutting scroll yet, Ihit Youdie.
And for the record: I wasn't enticed into anything, if people were worried about that.

Back on topic:
Calgor put it very well and I hope the development team is reading all this. I like Savage's idea of more red chat: communication is key here and we could use some more.

Considering this is on topic, a thing I posted on a different thread:

Personally I don't think it's so much favoritism as it's too much coincidence all at once and it looks like favoritism. Fighter with a ridiculous amount of HP for their level gets the scroll for the quest against a non group mob with a ridiculous amount of HP for the level, person that is very frequently buying and selling collector items gets the secret shop scroll, etc sounds like favoritism. But then you have the high level fighter getting the woodcutting scroll, a few people that don't mine get the mine scrolls, a lower level fighter then gets the quest scroll from fishing those don't sound like favoritism so yes I think it was just coincidence. I do think the drops have an issue and it's the way the expansion is being handed out. The scrolls as drops seem to be based on a similar concept in much bigger MMOs where a very rare drop is needed to unlock the next areas but the community is just too small for that to be a viable way to release an update and expect people to not feel the drops are handed out to favorites. The benefit those other games have is a much larger player base meaning a much larger amount of people getting the drops. In those other games there's a large enough amount of people getting the drop that it can form its own community within the game around that but here it's looking like the "boys club" getting Early Access to what's supposed to be a game wide expansion.

Just my thoughts on it.

We need communication from the dev team. They shouldn't tell us everything but they should tell us the basics of how things work and plans for the future.

Scrolls don't fit syrnia's past or lore, they don't even make sense following the story told through red chat. They are both illogical and based on luck for all we know at the moment.

Why do you need a scroll of ancient wood to randomly get a drop from a forest many people have overleveled by hundreds of levels?

Why do you need some dusty old scroll to see a mine that other people next to you are using? Call it a permit or a map or something.

The only one that makes sense is for the palace quest and that one should drop at a single location with much higher drop rate.

MMOs don't lock maps or areas behind
extremely rare drops, you need the drops to beat the boss that doesn't fit with syrnia where it's not 99% about combat.

I am ok with the idea of luck, luck is part of life and a bigger part of synria.
but i am not ok with monopoly.
I am ok with the idea that you have more chance for good drops when you have high level in a skill but closing a part of a skill even for people who got the levels is not ok for me.
My suggestion is to make quests to get scrolls, or at least make each skill scroll drop from doing the same skill at high level locations (in Anasco/Calmere for example).

Note: I remember when some suggestions for premium points options were refused because they make playing the game easier and they are not fair.

Edited on 16-06-2020 23:34

sounds like folks just want tiromyth to be worthless as fast as possible

Worthless as fast as possible or just not overpriced as much as possible so a clan can exploit exclusive use to it? I am completely against luck based exclusivity in the end game as much as possible and have always been against exclusivity. I don't care if the drop rate is lowered I just want everyone to have an equal chance at what is now the end game content and has the potential for huge gameplay inequalities if it remains as exclusive as it is.

everyone had equal chance to buy the scrolls when they were for sale. not our fault others assumed they were worthless.

Wealth inequality is not an equal opportunity, I thought you of all people would know that

Now please, bring back comments with substance. More suggestions

Edited on 17-06-2020 00:19

if you cant afford 500k why should you have access to endgame tools anyway?

If I have the levels why not if I have a way to get them that'd be great but as it stands there are too few ways to actually get them to call any of this an equal opportunity

Twitxky - 500k? Current rate for a scroll is full dragon suit and has no takers

I dislike the luck based element of getting them, I wish it had been something you earned more, whether a grinded for quest or something else. That's not going to change, but I do wish we at the very least knew where they came from? That isn't alot to ask?

I would also add, and I think many people have said, Calmere Island itself is a great update and was sorely needed.

TLDR: Love a little more clarity, hate the luck mechanic but I'll live, really happy the game's being updated.

I think it makes sense that level 150 content is worth more than level 115 content. apparently some people think the best tools in the game should cost less than 100k though.

then just reduce the drop rate? There are ways to impact prices other than leaving it exclusive and hoping people don't try to take advantage of that. Even in the real world they've seen how bad a monopoly can be let's not try to let a game show us why it's bad either

There’s no monopoly. There is more than one set of scrolls and as far as I know they can still drop

There is no need to make this exclusive, anyone can notice how tools, weapons and armour prices raise from platina to syriet to obby to pura. new tools can go the same way, rare ores, more ores required to make a bar. and they will still be expensive.

I believe palace scroll should drop exclusively at barracks as a super rare drop. As joves stated, renaming the scrolls to something more fitting like mining permit makes more sense flavour wise. The dev team should have updated the manual to include ancient wood, bloodstone ore and other new information within the manual as the island opened; this is gross negligence on their part as there is sheer lack of communcation between the players and the dev team.

tl;dr scrolls are fine the way they are but fix the manual. it shouldn't take more than 30 mins to add all the new stuff and it would provide much needed clarity

In this thread: People whining because daddy dev won't spoon feed them their dinner.

If people liked the scroll mechanic they wouldn't be asking to be spoon fed by the developers. Obviously enough people don't for this to be a big deal and in that case communication is important. I haven't seen anyone asking to know everything. People that complain either want clarification or everything to be changed ') and personally I'm fine with both

All I know the playerbase has never been in this much discord due to an update, so it's objectively not been a good one, globally.

I agree with both of you, Joves, Seph.

Edit: I will add that, yes you can work as a clan trying to maximize the chances of getting a scroll, but being so rare and needing various different scrolls, the odds of a clan achieving their way to tiromyth is low, as has been seen. This puts tiromyth in the hands of luck in general lines.

Edited on 17-06-2020 13:46

I strongly disagree with the complaints about this update and i'll explain my thoughts on why.


First and foremost, a random chance for a scroll to drop from an activity, which I believe is our current best guess for how to obtain them, is the only truly fair way to give all players an equal chance of accessing the scrolls. Everyone is on a level playing field in this regard, as everyone has the same random chance to access them. I think that the drop rates being low is fine and intended, as a new and hard to obtain material, high level material, should be exactly that, new and hard to obtain. Skills have high level unlocks to work towards and players are rewarded with those unlocks after investing a large amount of time into obtaining the levels. For a new material that has a high level requirement to use, i think it's entirely fair for it to be difficult to get hold of. To increase the drop rate of scrolls and make them more accessible would only make this new material more accessible and devalue the time and effort needed to hit the level requirements for it.


I also think that this update does a lot more to encourage clan cooperation than any update in the past. Many clans in the game have long had a culture of cooperation in helping members achieve each others goals. By adding a material that requires a combination of scrolls and skills to make, it gives incentive for a clan to actively recruit players that have scrolls, or to purchase scrolls from others where possible. Obtaining these players or scrolls will be hard to do as I described above, but once a clan starts to get these requirements into place, it gives them the chance to start creating this new material and selling it, making the clan and its members money, thus rewarding the effort put into acquiring the scrolls, levels and materials required.


As it stands what we know of the new material is that tools, weapons and armour made from it will have very high level requirements, so only those that have spent a long time unlocking those levels will be able to use them. To make them more accessible doesn't make any sense when the majority of players may not be able to use it at all for a long while yet. Which combined with the drop rate for it, we as a community will gradually increase accessibility to the new material as more scrolls drop over time, which coincides with the time required for more players to obtain more levels and eventually be able to use the new material.



I think this is a fantastic and interesting update and everyone involved in creating it deserves a lot of praise for their efforts.

Can't help but notice the majority of the people defending the update being from TLO and TF.

Yuuko your opinion would be very different being on the outside looking in.

Of course its a wonderful thing for your clan to do together, maybe put yourself in the shoes of everyone currently feeling like they've been shafted. You know, every other clan that hasn't had them drop.

As I've made clear in world chat on several occasions, I completely disagree with the monopoly style of this update. I think the point has been raised several times in this thread so I won't echo that.

I don't see how this encourages clan/team play. It's all down to luck and the player base is not large enough to support it.

Good concept, but just doesn't fit the current state of the game.

Smitts, my thoughts would be exactly the same regardless of what clan I was in or even in no clan at all.

Everyone having the same random chance or low drop rate is a fair system in my opinion, and I do not think that high tier items should be readily accessible to a large number of people for any game. If you balance for the inexperienced then there is no reward for those that commit a lot of time and effort to getting high levels.

This discussion about the scrolls is going in circles. Right now we need communication from the dev team. There are pros and cons to this luck-system of the scrolls. Yes, it's annoying to know exclusive content is based on luck and that potentially a scroll can end up with someone that can't even use it. It's true that this luck-drop gives everyone an equal chance of getting it, regardless of their combat level and whatnot.

At June 5th, Bex posted in another topic (Forum -> Help -> New Update) and said this:
"As I said I would, I have spoken to the Dev team. I can say that it's possible for anyone to get a scroll but that they are rare.
So keep at it and you might be the next lucky player.
How they are obtained is for all of us to work out"

Which is good to know, but it this point we should hear something from the dev team themselves. They have seen the malcontent in the playerbase since the beginning of this month and it's not getting better.

We don't need to have all the plans for the future revealed, and if they want the scrolls to remain rare then so be it, but some of the questions the players have can easily be answered without spoiling everything or giving away more scrolls.
They can reveal how many of each scroll has dropped so far to give people an insight of how easy they are to obtain instead of relying on the people that came forth in the chat or on the forum.
They can hint if scrolls can be obtained with every skill or if they only drop with certain skills.
They can reveal if people who already have a scroll still have an equal chance to find another or a lower chance.
They can hint if the rare drops of bloodstone ore and ancient wood always rely on luck, or if the chances increase with a certain amount of actions (and if that is the case whether or not those increases chances reset when the scrolls changes ownernship or the scrollowner leaves the place or logs out)
Maybe hint if finding scrolls is solely based luck or whether they are released in batches and then require luck to find.

As Calgor said, it should be made clear through what actions we can find the scrolls to stop players from speculating and allowing them to start the grind to obtain the rare scrolls.

Just talk to us, dev team. Ease our minds, or at least acknowledge you heard the complains of the player base.



Edit: added some things that could potentially be cleared up or hinted about by the dev team.

Edited on 17-06-2020 18:02

Edited on 18-06-2020 07:54

" If you balance for the inexperienced then there is no reward for those that commit a lot of time and effort to getting high levels." - problem with this argument is that it isn't balanced for the people who HAVE put in the time and effort into getting the levels. You act like only 1 person has the level to do the skills but they are quite a few players that have put in the time and effort and are being left out because of what - luck ? To be left out of being able to utilize an update that they have worked hard for is just bullshit imo!!!

Well said Liah

Bcnu, to say that you feel left out when the update has only just hit is ridiculous. All the published information from the people who have scrolls so far indicates that the drop rate of the actual resources needed to make it is itself very low, and so it should be for a high tier metal.


It's going to take time to get steady production started, you sound like you expect it to be readily available right this minute which I have to dismiss as absurd.

yukko - I am not arguing the point of getting resources going etc....The point is everyone who has worked "hard " according to your post to get those levels are being left out from producing them as well just because of luck - that is the point. I don't expect to use any of it anytime soon which is fine because I haven't worked those skills but players who have it is not logical that they can't access the areas. Also for players who would like to access these areas eventually have no basis or guidance from the game itself as to how to do so. And yes some players are posting but that was only after these forums got started so please don't think that people have been transparent from the start because they weren't. Really all anyone seems to be asking for is for the update to be fair to ALL players not just a select few.

This argument seems like a watch my right hand while my left is doing something else. So it's okay that some players have advantages over others with the same or lower levels than those being left out? That is the point of the players who have been posting not the availability of the product etc......

This has gone so far from feedback and more of an entertaining bickering match to read at work.

As many suggested in chat and forums, it should have been a quest chain. You could have made the scrolls like the lost girl quest where once you start the quest you have a chance to get the drop. Not a completely random(as we know its random for the time being) drop. You don't know what or where exactly to have a chance for the scroll, even if red chat suggested other islands etc.

When did these scrolls release, because I had one xD How new are they?

Around the launch of Calmere - dacheez , they're considerd extremely valuable, due to their exclusive access to endgame content.

Edited on 17-06-2020 23:35

In my opinion it is frustrating, however isn't it equally as frustrating when someone gets a four leaf clover at speed level 11(or any level), or when one shot away from killing a dragon and you barely miss the drop?

No, Dirk, dragons spawn far more frequently and have a clear way to get the drops. 4 Leaf Clovers do not influence how you play the game, it's a collectors item. Neither of which lock you out of content as you do not need a dragon suit to fight dragons or enter any secret areas and 4 leaf clover as previously said do not influence how you play the game. They are not an equal comparison, it would be more like if you only saw dragons if you found a Lapis and brought it with you to Arch 5 and then you needed a Jade to see obby, pura, and titanium ores. Even then those gems have a clear way to be found while scrolls are a "idk man it's probably just random globally who knows"

you dont need tiro weapons or tools to do anything in the game

I see. I didn't look at it in that way.

I think the scrolls should have been like the Diamond shaped glass and lost girl.. Not able to be traded.

But in those examples you knew exactly what you had to do to get them. Now it's everyone's guess. And it involved a quest to get them, the scrolls are just random luck. That is at least how it appears to be right now.

Edited on 18-06-2020 19:01

Add Scroll of Thieving.

It's not about luck, or how often scrolls should drop.They should not exist to block people from using the skills they trained.We train skills to be able to do higher things, if the game don't let us what is the reason to do it?
Imagine wikid, the best miner and smith in the game, having to buy his ultimate tools and weapons (for months? years? who knows) from some obscure smith (you realise how this sounds, right? now I wait for Twitchy and Calgor to explain us how normal this is).Maybe with a future update 90% of the high fishers/cooks won't be allowed to use the new fish, or aussie being kept away for months from a new forest.
This is wrong.This is not the game I(we?) played and enjoyed for 15 years.And if this is the way for future updates to get implemented, then I don't think I want to be here to see them.

Edited on 21-06-2020 07:38

well.... its been over a month, I have been waiting in hope the new areas may have opened by now, or the scrolls may have become more accessible.

Can we please have some feedback from the update team to give us some direction. (I believe most of us will agree the fun is over and frustration is setting in)

I figure I need at least 3 scrolls to have a chance of making a tiro bar. At the current drop rate, I am predicting years.

The big question is... Is there something we still need to discover or is this it, we need scrolls to progress and they are extremely rare?

Drop rates either need to be made higher or we should be able to buy them from somewhere.

I fished up just over 11,000 bass(10364 bass and 1116 Spotted Bass) and got nothing.

Am totally with Stolo and wikid on this. I think if the game mechanic is going to start being messed with, there needs to be a LOT more transparency in A) What is being done and why and B) What exactly IS required in order to access the new content.

Obviously the Scrolls haven't worked out as "drops" so have a damned re-think and either amend the drop rate, expand on what drops them to make that happen with a little more frequency or just put them as a shop bought item.

It's disappointing that B2H and his "Team" after ALL these years, still haven't managed to figure out the needs of the community or managed to come up with a well thought out update.

From what I can tell these scrolls granting access to the materials needed to make the new metal are rare and hard to obtain, and thats intended. If we start demanding the scrolls be more accessible it only devalues the new metal right at the start of its lifespan.

But no, tell us how to get it, make them easier to get etc etc. Tiromyth bars for everyone! /s

I mean getting to level 140 in a skill or attack level 150+ seems like a pretty rare thing anyway. But no you're right, there's no need to let people have access to the items, let's also then gate them off behind a lucky drop.

Titanium also isn't particularly abundant so even if these scrolls dropped by the hundreds tiromyth would still not exactly be common.

Edit: Yuuko also, why don't you want Tiromyth for everyone? Platina, yeah we all have access, syriet, of course, obsidian/puranium yes let people access that as well, but Tiromyth?! Heaven forbid the masses can get to that !

Edited on 21-06-2020 19:39

I'm all for people having access smitts, and in time it will start top become more available as more scrolls drop. This is a slow process though.

I don't remember when puranium was released but I can imagine it took a fair while before it started to become widely available. As it stands, with low availability at the moment, I think that is well balanced. I think this because the mechanics to obtain it e.g. the scrolls, will over time by the nature of being a rare drop become more available.

Puranium became available and anyone who had mining of 120 and a reasonable combat level had the ability to go and get it. Yes eventually it filtered out, but people who had the levels had the ability to go and get it.

There's a quest to access AC5, requires 8k actions. Then there is the combat needed to fight there, and then the mining to get to the ore. Then you need someone with a smithing level high enough. Hence, its a lot of work and team work needed for that ore/bar and item. So it took time for it to filter out.

Here, you need to be stupidly lucky? That is what upsets people. And its not just that you need to be stupidly lucky, we still have no idea from what skills/locations it can and can't drop?

Even if there were hundreds of scrolls in the game. You need 3 scrolls, a smith with smithing 150 and combat high enough to survive the auto attacks. A woodcutter at 55 with the scroll relying on a fairly rare drop. A miner with mining 85, relying on a fairly rare drop. You also need puranium and titanium, requiring a miner with 120/140 mining, the combat level to survive the auto attacks who has beaten other players to get to the ore spawn, of which they know where it is, the ores spawning possibly once or twice a week.

You get these items would be rare anyway, they don't need to be locked behind a stupid luck mechanic? Players had to put an insane amount of hours in to get to the above levels, they will need to work together anyway. There's no need to then on top of that, lock them away behind insanely lucky drops?

People don't want the items just handed to them, that isn't what they're asking for. They just don't think this was the way to do it, and are voicing that opinion.

I suppose a better way of explaining it is, I think the low drop rate rng of the scrolls give this new metal a good pace.

IMO it's not about pace, the issue is progress and equal chances.

With puranium, if you had the levels you had an equal chance as everybody else to get the stuff. And you felt the progress, even if it was slow.

Now, your level and hours you invest might make no difference. As long as you don't get the scroll drop, your progress is zero as you can't try to change something to increase your chances.

And as nobody knows how the scrolls drop, it might be something as obscure as: donate exactly 13 gp to calmere university, then in the next 15 minutes a scroll might drop when mining tin ore, but only on the 2nd Tuesday of the month, from 09:00 to 09:30 server time.

Yes, that is exaggerating, but the point is until a meaningful amount of scrolls actually enters the game, there will be unequality, and resource monopoly.
That monopoly will lead to an xp gains edge, or market domination (overpriced tools/weapons lead to an edge in other skills, like farming/thieving/magic ofc), which should not be desireable in the long run.

Also the argument that these lucky/obscure drops set a good pace is moot, if there will be a meaningfull amount of them in the future than this whole setup only created a delay which a few can capitalize on in the meantime. Long time result will be zero.

To keep the resoruces scarce (if intended) in the future all of these scrolls would actually have to be used up: e.g. mining scroll is used up after finding a fixed amount of bloodstone ores (or something like a 50% "break" chance per ore found or so).

The release of Puranium is in no way similar to this release. When puranium launched every active clan that had a miner to mine it either had an equal chance at acquiring it or had the means to train their combat to be able to safely traverse Arch 5 and get it. I mined 1000s of ores in Arch 5 upon release of the content both for OLD and as a freelancer. And nothing hindered my ability to mine other than having to occasionally clear chests and fight dragons to increase spawns

Its clearly flawed and hopefully the coding team learn from this.

Otherwise for the rest of the update, It has been really superb, all the new content has been outstanding and I think this debate in itself takes away from the hard work you put in which is probably disappointing.

Even though I think the scrolls release and quest are flawed - I wanted to say thanks anyway, appreciate the work has went in.

NH

Well at very least it has sparked off a decent and healthy forum debate, not to mention the fact that a 15 year old browser game is still being updated with new content. That's actually pretty impressive if you ask me.

Games like this are always something of a work in progress, if something that is implemented doesn't work well then it will be modified or replaced eventually. This is why these sort of player debates are very helpful, they help guide the future of the game. But I do think it's worth not losing sight of the fact that we are very lucky to still be getting updates at all. And a lot of work and effort has gone into this update, I think a little gratitude is due from us all really for this fact.

It's totally reasonable to complain if something isn't working properly, but nobody was purposefully trying to make anybodies life harder. Having seen games die of old age over the years makes me feel more inclined to be grateful than to complain however.

So thanks to all involved in keeping this game running all this time. We only moan cus we care.

Wow, well, interesting reading for certain.

I had a break from the game, came back a couple of weeks ago, and hey presto, we have a new island. Pretty cool stuff, took a quick look around, a few quests n such like, not purely for the really high lvl players, all round, I thought a good addition.
I kept seeing these scrolls coming up in chat as well. Didn't really think too much of it until I started to spot a few not so happy comments about it.
I have just read through this, and another post plus replies about this very subject.
I just want to add briefly that I have to agree with what appears to be a large portion of players who would like some clarity as to how to obtain these items.
As a player who has played solo in the past, and probably will do again in the future, without the backing of a clan it would be nice (as already mentioned) if the actual way to obtain these items was added to the manual. I tried to find it in there myself. Neither the mining or woodcutting guides say anything about scrolls, apart from the bottom of mining, but again doesn't say how to obtain it. From what I have seen, these items are pure and simple outright luck to find. This is really really not a good way to operate. Rare is fine, it should be for a while, but it should still be accessible to players who have the lvls to use/obtain in whatever skill they major in. I currently am woodcutting to get to lvl 100 to cut at the lvl 100 forest. I would think that by that time I should be able to chop everywhere (assuming the quests completed etc etc) but it sounds like I still can't access the wood on calmere, or if I can, I can't obtain certain drops without this scroll??
That, would not be a case of lucky or not, that would be simply, and looks like it is to some players, a kick in the gut. I hope to play here for years to come, it is a great game, I genuinely love it, but I have always had something to aim for where I know I need xxx lvl to be able to do xxx action. If we are going in the direction where I could get to the required lvl to do something, but still can't do it due to luck and an absolutely crazy low drop rate, I wonder, what is the incentive to carry on?

IMO, to make it fair, make it quest based. It is a simple, proven means of making something difficult but rewarding to obtain. You wanna make the gained items rare, make the quests really tough/high lvl to complete, thus making the 'grind' well worthwhile.
It also takes away the shop option of being able to buy it whereby a clan of any size can just happily purchase without having to do the work.

Kind regards all,
Thanks to all, Dev team and players, you're all pretty awesome.

Genie.

Edited on 05-09-2020 13:02